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> Darth Maul outnumbered in the hanger, why didn't they just shoot him?
paul73
post Feb 2 2008, 11:22 PM
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In Episode I, Qui-Gonn, Kenobi and Amidala first encounter Darth Maul on Naboo in the hanger along with about 10-15 of Amidala's armed guard. It is at this point that Gui-Gonn turns to Amidala and says "We'll take it from here". Amidala and her armed escort depart a different way, and the 2 jedi take on Maul.

Later on in the saga, we learn that a lone person with jedi skills can actually be killed by armed soldiers, as long as there are enough soldiers. Many jedi are killed in the battle on Geonosis by battle droids in Ep. 2. Virtually all the remaining jedi are killed in Ep. 3 by clone troupers.

So, why didn't Amidala and her soldiers just open fire as a united front on Maul? Could he really have deflected all those shots?
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Grand Moff
post Feb 3 2008, 12:19 PM
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You’re right. They probably would have a decent chance of taking him out. But he would have taken many of them with him in the process, leaving Padme and Panaka (if they weren’t killed them selves) with far fewer soldiers to complete their mission. The whole Gungan army had committed itself to a hopeless battle in order to give the Naboo a slight chance of infiltrating the palace and capturing the Viceroy. It would have been downright criminal to waste that chance by fighting with a Sith, if there was any possibility of continuing the mission. In effect, Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan volunteered to a delaying action, just like the Gungans had, so that the rest of the group could continue.


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Rebel_A96
post Feb 3 2008, 06:16 PM
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Qui-Gon said he would take care of it and so I think they just thought that don't argue with a Jedi thing. Also it looked as if they were a bit shocked to see a Sith in their path, and were all but too happy to get out of there.

GM's point is good too.


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Leiafan
post Feb 4 2008, 10:18 AM
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Because he was a Sith and could block blaster fire.


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Madison_rogue
post Feb 5 2008, 03:24 AM
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QUOTE (Leiafan @ Feb 4 2008, 03:18 AM)
Because he was a Sith and could block blaster fire.

Although that's entirely plausible, I agree more with GM's theory. After a thousand years of lurking in the shadows I doubt that the Naboo Royal Guard would have known that Maul could have deflected blaster bolts.

I tend to sway towards Qui Gon and Obi Wan taking on the task because Maul was a Jedi affair, and the overall mission took precedence over fighting a Sith Lord. Instead of further endangering the Queen, splitting up seems to be the overall best option. wink.gif


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Grand Moff
post Feb 5 2008, 07:09 PM
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QUOTE (Leiafan @ Feb 4 2008, 10:18 AM)
Because he was a Sith and could block blaster fire.

Do you think that a Sith is better than a Jedi at blocking shots?

As paul73 have noted, in the PT we have many examples of Jedi being overwhelmed by sheer numbers. I guess using the Force is all about concentration, and if you have to divide your attention between two opponents, then your Force-Defence-Factor (for lack of a less RPG-sounding word wink.gif ) is also reduced. The more opponents, the lower the FDF, until we reach a point where even the ordinary Joe can take a Jedi down.

I had assumed that the same would be true of the Sith, but you may be right. Maybe the Sith does have a higher skill in fighting. Almost every Sith in the PT is outnumbered by Jedi in battle, yet still mostly hold their own.

Does this mean that the Sith are superior to Jedi, or just that the Jedi focuses less on the martial aspects of the Force? Interesting question.


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paul73
post Feb 6 2008, 01:06 AM
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QUOTE (Grand Moff @ Feb 5 2008, 07:09 PM)
QUOTE (Leiafan @ Feb 4 2008, 10:18 AM)
Because he was a Sith and could block blaster fire.

Do you think that a Sith is better than a Jedi at blocking shots?

As paul73 have noted, in the PT we have many examples of Jedi being overwhelmed by sheer numbers. I guess using the Force is all about concentration, and if you have to divide your attention between two opponents, then your Force-Defence-Factor (for lack of a less RPG-sounding word wink.gif ) is also reduced. The more opponents, the lower the FDF, until we reach a point where even the ordinary Joe can take a Jedi down.

I had assumed that the same would be true of the Sith, but you may be right. Maybe the Sith does have a higher skill in fighting. Almost every Sith in the PT is outnumbered by Jedi in battle, yet still mostly hold their own.

Does this mean that the Sith are superior to Jedi, or just that the Jedi focuses less on the martial aspects of the Force? Interesting question.

I don't recall any instances of Sith blocking several blasters as once, but I do agree with you that there were several instances when a Sith was fighting more than one Jedi at one time (Maul vs. Qui-Gonn and Kenobi; Dooku vs. Kenobi and Anakin in both Ep. 2 and 3).

I think the Sith are more agressive than Jedi, which may make them better fighters. I also thought that Qui-Gonn had a facial expression showing intimidation when he was fighting Maul.

Yeah, overall I would say that, on average, Sith are better fighters than Jedi.
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Madison_rogue
post Feb 6 2008, 05:00 AM
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QUOTE (paul73 @ Feb 5 2008, 06:06 PM)
Yeah, overall I would say that, on average, Sith are better fighters than Jedi.

See, this is where I disagree.

A Jedi approaches a battle differently than a Sith does. Jedi approach on a harmonious level, while a Sith allows his/her emotions to take over; supposedly because strength gives an edge vs. balance and finesse.

I believe you have to take into account the advantage that Maul & Tyranus had over their adversaries.

Qui Gon & Obi-Wan had never faced a Sith Lord (neither had any Jedi for nearly a thousand years), especially one trained with a double blade. There's a lot of unknowns that you have to take into account during that battle.

Tyranus had a lot of experience under his belt, and had trained Qui Gon. So it's easy to extrapolate that Dooku had quite an advantage facing Qui Gon's padawan, and his padawan's padawan. Granted this did not matter on their second encounter as Anakin easily beat Dooku.

I believe the entire goal of a Sith during a battle is to get it over quickly through brute force and sheer will. A Jedi, given they can fend off the first few minutes of a battle, would then have the advantage because they prepare themselves for a long battle. This may not be the case with every Jedi or every Sith, but it sure seems to play out this way in what I've seen.


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masterbrad6
post Sep 20 2008, 01:54 AM
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dunno if Maul could have blocked the shots... but hell how BAD A$$ is Maul for just showing up and willing to slaughter them all... no matter how many soldiers and Jedi were in his way.


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darthnecrum
post Apr 24 2009, 03:48 PM
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QUOTE
I guess using the Force is all about concentration, and if you have to divide your attention between two opponents, then your Force-Defence-Factor (for lack of a less RPG-sounding word wink.gif ) is also reduced. The more opponents, the lower the FDF, until we reach a point where even the ordinary Joe can take a Jedi down.


Excellent and interesting point about FDF, but in this scenario the tactic of distracting Maul so he could be shot has a disadvantage for Obi wan and Qui Gon in that they could get shot too.

QUOTE
how BAD A$$ is Maul for just showing up and willing to slaughter them all... no matter how many soldiers and Jedi were in his way.


Totally agree, Darth Maul is awesomely Bad A$$! evil.gif evil.gif evil.gif cool.gif

I agree with all the above arguments. Also, in any surprise attack, time is of the essence, and Amidala and Panaka needed to reach the throne room to capture Gunray before he retreated, which was likely to happen sooner than later knowing what a coward he was. Qui Gon could have decided to hold Maul in the hanger so the others could reach their objective without delay.


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Rebel Clone
post Jan 12 2010, 10:03 AM
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All interesting posts. The Sith do seem to be stronger, and have a more powerfull use of the force and the jedi act more with knowledge and use of the shield in their acts.
But back to the point I believe Maul could have taken out many of them if he wished.

Qui-Gon obviously felt a dark and powerfull presence thus hinting them that he will take it. Im also sure they were shocked to see him since they thought they were just going to be taking down mindless droids and not a sith.

Maul was indeed powerfull however, he was still an apprentice and was able to handle a Jedi Master and a Jedi Padawan flawlessly until Obi-Wan came out with true skill!


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Zideric
post Jan 18 2010, 05:37 PM
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I think the Sith could be stronger than the Jedi, because the Sith are prepared to use pure destructive power, while the Jedi prefer not to kill to start with. Sith usually come alone, so they dont have to worry about hitting their allies, and Jedi mostly come to protect others.

Btw, why not turn this entire thing around? Why would Maul just jump over Qui-gon and Obi-wan, and kill the queen right away? He could just have slashed through everyone, and then focus on Qui-gon and Obi-wan again. It would also intimidate them, because they wouldnt have anything to fight for anymore. Qui-gon and Obi-wan wouldnt have much chance to defend the queen, because then they would hit her themselves.

And one other thing, they didnt have much time to think about it. Just fast thinking: split up, lightsaber-to-lightsaber, and continue the mission. We are able to type an entire page of options. They had to act much quicker.


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zedhatch
post Jan 19 2010, 03:58 AM
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On Sith being stronger, Yoda makes this very clear in Empire Stirkes Back so I defer to him on this matter.

On Maul getting killed vs. Jedi getting killed. The Jedi were caught off guard by troopers they thought were thier allies. Every attack in order 66 was from behind. Yoda just felt the disteebance in the Force and Obi-wan got lucky.

As for Jedi who died in the Clone Wars themselves (before order 66), most were taken out either by a weapon of near mass destruction (Artilery with wide blast radius for example) or a Jedi like enemy (grevious, Dooku,). I am hard pressed to think of a death of a Jedi that doesn't fall into those two circumstances, even in the EU.


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AdmiralTreyDavid
post Mar 20 2010, 08:10 AM
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I agree with all of the points on why they didn't shoot Maul; they had a mission to get on with and that definitely wasn't in the cards.

As for why Maul didn't just hop over Qui-Gon/Obi-Wan, I'm guessing it has something to do with how obsessed Maul was with wanting to kill Jedi. You get a little taste of this obsession in a few lines (which are like 75% of Maul's lines for the whole movie -_-) in which he talks about how happy he is to finally get to get revenge on the Jedi, but if you read the book "Shadow Hunter" by Michael Reaves you'll see Maul explained much more deeply.

Maul was basically a character that was very combat-oriented. I doubt he was really thinking about what taking out the Queen would do at all. He saw two Jedi and was probably only thinking about how he was going to destroy them.


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master_palin
post Mar 22 2010, 09:10 PM
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Pure and simple.. It was a SW movie and we needed to see an awesome lightsaber dual between good and evil jedi and Sith This is the Jedi at their height before the fall of the republic and we see how bad @$$ they where in combat with lightsabers.

Now could it have been written where they open fire and qui and obi block back some of Mauls blocked shots and they take him down in no time sure.. could anikin or another pilot just as easly turned a ships blasters on maul and vaped him sure.. many possiblilties but then we wouldnt have gotten are amazing sword fight.



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Darth Dahak
post Sep 23 2010, 03:50 PM
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Could of been Qui-Gon's pride. His past within the order is a rough one, with his first padawan turning to the dark side, and him sometimes not on the good side of the council. Maybe he wanted to prove something, since this was the first confrontation a jedi has had with a sith in a long time (not counting the battle on tatooine).

And of course Obi-Wan wouldn't go against him as he looked to his master as a father.


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